The Official President Obama Discussion Topic

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Led Guardian
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The Official President Obama Discussion Topic

#1 Post by Led Guardian » 06 Jun 2008 02:21

I just got back from watching Obama's first speech of the general election campaign, and I would like to say...

It was incredible! He is an amazing speaker.

It was close to 90 degrees out, but nobody cared by the end of it. My throat is still raw from the screaming, and my hands are still red. I'm pretty psyched about this campaign. The man's like a rock star; he can get a crowd pumped just by being there!

Right now I'm feeling angrier than ever that I won't be able to vote. This is a monumental election, a chance to turn America around, and I turn eighteen half a month too late too vote. GAAAAAAAH!! :evil:

At least I got to see this historic speech, though. Now we just need to beat McCain so we can say "Yes we did"!
Last edited by Led Guardian on 12 Dec 2008 23:26, edited 1 time in total.
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#2 Post by Sarah » 06 Jun 2008 10:40

:)

yay :)
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#3 Post by West Virginia Mule » 06 Jun 2008 12:08

Fuck that motherfucking motherfucker.

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#4 Post by Frozen within » 06 Jun 2008 12:37

Obama heerscht.
Eat more vegetables !

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#5 Post by ThePKH » 06 Jun 2008 14:54

Certainly a battle between a young and an old guy. I'd vote for the new.
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#6 Post by Ornendil » 06 Jun 2008 14:56

Forza young guy!
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#7 Post by Joost » 06 Jun 2008 15:07

Frozen within wrote:Obama heerscht.
^^
You charge each other for the time and breath it takes to say 'good morning',
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Watch our empires sink and wash away like castles made of sand.
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#8 Post by Gandalf de Grijze » 06 Jun 2008 15:11

Joost wrote:
Frozen within wrote:Obama heerscht.
^^
that
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#9 Post by Guilherme » 06 Jun 2008 17:00

It's good to see young people engaged in politics. Way to go man.

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#10 Post by Skyclad » 06 Jun 2008 17:20

I was hoping Clinto would clinch the candidacy, but it was clear a month ago she wouldn't. I'm hoping that she becomes the VP candidate. It's actually the only way I think the Dems can beat McCain is with both Obama and Clinton together.

That said, I don't like McCain, but even he would be a hell of a lot better than who is in the white house now.
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#11 Post by Orodaran » 06 Jun 2008 17:41

Well, it doesn't take that much anyway to be better than the current inhabitant of the White House, mh? :wink:
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#12 Post by Joost » 06 Jun 2008 18:14

You guys are all unpatriotic!
You charge each other for the time and breath it takes to say 'good morning',
But the truth is slowly dawning -- things are getting out of hand,
We all pursue our shattered dreams along the roads to our own ruin --
Watch our empires sink and wash away like castles made of sand.
And so cast off the lies that are your lives and find the truth within.
-- Martin Walkyier

Also, Balrogs have wings.

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#13 Post by Belgarion » 06 Jun 2008 20:33

I really hope Obama will be the next president. He is just lovely 8)
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Re: O-ba-ma! O-ba-ma!

#14 Post by Nodoordonotthereisnotry » 06 Jun 2008 21:57

Led Guardian wrote: and I turn eighteen half a month too late too vote. GAAAAAAAH!! :evil:
Are you sure? You should be able to vote. At least here in Greece.
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Re: O-ba-ma! O-ba-ma!

#15 Post by Led Guardian » 06 Jun 2008 22:47

Nodoordonotthereisnotry wrote:
Led Guardian wrote: and I turn eighteen half a month too late too vote. GAAAAAAAH!! :evil:
Are you sure? You should be able to vote. At least here in Greece.
In the US, you have to be born on that years election day (1st Tuesday of the month) or before to vote.
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#16 Post by West Virginia Mule » 07 Jun 2008 12:13

I was born in a mining town in 1958 (when black & white TV was up to date).

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Re: O-ba-ma! O-ba-ma!

#17 Post by ThePKH » 07 Jun 2008 12:13

Led Guardian wrote:
Nodoordonotthereisnotry wrote:
Led Guardian wrote: and I turn eighteen half a month too late too vote. GAAAAAAAH!! :evil:
Are you sure? You should be able to vote. At least here in Greece.
In the US, you have to be born on that years election day (1st Tuesday of the month) or before to vote.
We're having that kind of a system too. I think they should change it so you can vote during the year you turn 18. I think it would even raise the popularity of voting amongst young people.
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#18 Post by Guilherme » 07 Jun 2008 17:32

Here they changed the voting age to 16 for non obligatory voting and when you are 18 you need to vote, and it didn't raise voting popularity at all :p

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#19 Post by Guilherme » 07 Jun 2008 17:34

The Wrong Mule wrote:I was born in a mining town in 1958 (when black & white TV was up to date).

This night I had a dream with you (yup, really) and black and white tvs, you have no idea how freaked out I got when I read this.

I think I need treatment, the kind with plugs in the head and electricity involved. :P

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#20 Post by nailz » 08 Jun 2008 07:46

The Wrong Mule wrote:I was born in a mining town in 1958 (when black & white TV was up to date).
And even until now, if you listen carefully at night, you can hear them. The Angels still weep.
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#21 Post by Orodaran » 08 Jun 2008 09:51

The Wrong Mule wrote:I was born in a mining town in 1958 (when black & white TV was up to date).
And men were still around, who fought for freedom..... :wink:
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#22 Post by No‘am » 08 Jun 2008 10:06

I'm sorry but objectively speaking, I don't see how Obama could function as a president, McCain seems like the only real polititian there among the candidates. Obama (and Clinton) both seemed like a joke, I can't see either of them leading the US. They just don't have anything going for them.
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#23 Post by Joost » 08 Jun 2008 11:57

No‘am wrote:I'm sorry but objectively speaking, I don't see how Obama could function as a president, McCain seems like the only real polititian there among the candidates. Obama (and Clinton) both seemed like a joke, I can't see either of them leading the US. They just don't have anything going for them.
Remember we're talking about a country with a history of jokes-as-presidents.
You charge each other for the time and breath it takes to say 'good morning',
But the truth is slowly dawning -- things are getting out of hand,
We all pursue our shattered dreams along the roads to our own ruin --
Watch our empires sink and wash away like castles made of sand.
And so cast off the lies that are your lives and find the truth within.
-- Martin Walkyier

Also, Balrogs have wings.

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#24 Post by No‘am » 08 Jun 2008 12:17

At least make it a good joke then.
I'd like to see Robin Williams as prez
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#25 Post by Joost » 08 Jun 2008 12:44

No‘am wrote:At least make it a good joke then.
I'd like to see Robin Williams as prez
Well, we've had Chuck Norris endorsing Mike Huckabee (who is also quite a bit of a joke), but what about Chuck himself running for president?
You charge each other for the time and breath it takes to say 'good morning',
But the truth is slowly dawning -- things are getting out of hand,
We all pursue our shattered dreams along the roads to our own ruin --
Watch our empires sink and wash away like castles made of sand.
And so cast off the lies that are your lives and find the truth within.
-- Martin Walkyier

Also, Balrogs have wings.

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#26 Post by End Of An Era » 08 Jun 2008 12:55

chuck norris for president?

well that sure as hell will frighten some criminals :P

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#27 Post by Orodaran » 08 Jun 2008 13:26

Just give some reality to the Simpsons movie and make Schwarzenegger president.
"There's a time when a man needs to fight and a time when he needs to accept that his destiny's lost, the ship has sailed and that only a fool will continue. The truth is I've always been a fool"
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A slight call afar is tempting me, like a whisper sweet or an awful scream; I cannot ignore what I've always been, I'm leaving again - one last time? in my little kingdom I can be what I really wanted to be... The wanderer

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#28 Post by End Of An Era » 08 Jun 2008 14:11

he can't, you have to be born in the US in order to become president. right? it's waht i heard at least :P

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#29 Post by Led Guardian » 08 Jun 2008 17:53

Why would you want to elect McCain? We already know that Bush's policies are bad for this country (and the rest of the world for that matter), and McCain voted along party lines for almost 90% of the time during this current Congress. This country can't handle another 4 or more years of such unenlightened leadership.
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#30 Post by ThePKH » 08 Jun 2008 20:18

Joost wrote:
No‘am wrote:At least make it a good joke then.
I'd like to see Robin Williams as prez
Well, we've had Chuck Norris endorsing Mike Huckabee (who is also quite a bit of a joke), but what about Chuck himself running for president?
For Chuck Norris being a president of United States would mean coming down several steps from that mighty throne of his. That's like GWB suddenly wanting to be the mayor of Jyväskylä.
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#31 Post by Skyclad » 09 Jun 2008 06:23

ThePKH wrote:
Joost wrote:
No‘am wrote:At least make it a good joke then.
I'd like to see Robin Williams as prez
Well, we've had Chuck Norris endorsing Mike Huckabee (who is also quite a bit of a joke), but what about Chuck himself running for president?
For Chuck Norris being a president of United States would mean coming down several steps from that mighty throne of his. That's like GWB suddenly wanting to be the mayor of Jyväskylä.
George couldn't spell "Jyvaskyla". In fact, he can't spell "mayor", either.
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#32 Post by ThePKH » 09 Jun 2008 14:53

Skyclad wrote:
ThePKH wrote:
Joost wrote: Well, we've had Chuck Norris endorsing Mike Huckabee (who is also quite a bit of a joke), but what about Chuck himself running for president?
For Chuck Norris being a president of United States would mean coming down several steps from that mighty throne of his. That's like GWB suddenly wanting to be the mayor of Jyväskylä.
George couldn't spell "Jyvaskyla". In fact, he can't spell "mayor", either.
Well, the current guy can't spell his own name and the previous dude just got sentenced for drunk driving, so maybe it would still be an improvement.
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#33 Post by Zeernebrooch » 21 Jun 2008 00:05

Incoming Wall of Text!
also a disclaimer: All of you who have more a socialist/liberal/leftist point of view on politics and the running of a country, you will not like what i am going to type. I have no allegiances to any party because i do not believe they are what will save this declining country we call the USA. This is a post of opinion, so don't get all butt hurt over what i say, no matter how strongly you disagree with me.

personally don't want a democrat, no matter how bad the last republican pres was. For one thing the Socialized medicine will do nothing but raise taxes and probably end up costing us even more in the long run (yes i know that both sides are basically going to do it no matter what so don't pull that on me).

I hate the fact that the States have become a welfare state where you are not responsible for your own actions. Go bankrupt trying to "flip" houses? Here comes Uncle Sam to pay off your debt! All this crap is done using money from taxes that could be used on more important thing like that will do more help than letting some idiot that lost all their cash in real estate or what have you and helping people that need help because they have no other out let that can help them.
What i am trying to say is that people are now relying on government not to protect their rights and such but to be their mommy and make sure they can survive. This is NOT the reason for government, but it is soemthing that the left and to some extent the right intend to do.

And that is why i will probably not vote, along with he fact that in all truth one vote will not tip the balance in my area no matter who i chose to vote for. There will not be a truly great president IMO until we reach a time of great need (although it is arguable that we are in such a time).

Ether way we are S.O.L and J.W.F. Shit out of Luck and Jolly Well Fucked.
But that is just my opinion. keep in mind opinions are like ass holes, everyone has one and they all stink!
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#34 Post by ThePKH » 21 Jun 2008 17:06

Zeernebrooch wrote:What i am trying to say is that people are now relying on government not to protect their rights and such but to be their mommy and make sure they can survive. This is NOT the reason for government, but it is soemthing that the left and to some extent the right intend to do.
Don't know about the US, but in Finland healthcare is one of the most important, basic rights we have. Thus it's "free" (well you pay something but it's no problem). Even if the shit sometimes hits the fan (last year's nurses strike comes to mind) we do have trust left that our current and future governments keep this vital right for us to use.
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#35 Post by Zeernebrooch » 21 Jun 2008 17:45

ThePKH wrote:
Zeernebrooch wrote:What i am trying to say is that people are now relying on government not to protect their rights and such but to be their mommy and make sure they can survive. This is NOT the reason for government, but it is soemthing that the left and to some extent the right intend to do.
Don't know about the US, but in Finland healthcare is one of the most important, basic rights we have. Thus it's "free" (well you pay something but it's no problem). Even if the shit sometimes hits the fan (last year's nurses strike comes to mind) we do have trust left that our current and future governments keep this vital right for us to use.
Don't get me wrong i think in theory it can be a great idea, but for a country who's already in what a couple trillion in debt? I just do not see it as a good idea at the moment. Now once i am actually in need of the service perhaps i will see things differently.
Now if the socialized medicine plan had been around for as long here as it has in your country i would probably agree with you, but my idea of a "right" a bit different it seems, but that is the beauty of the world is it not? we all can have our own opinions and (depending on where u are) not get shot for it :)!

Incoming Tangent! (i am sorry i got hit with the writing bug this morning hehe)
I think most of my anti-big government comes from the fact that i hate that it gets to a point that a insane amount of the money that you worked for is used to fund things that will not necessarily be used by you. For instance i see the welfare system as the people that actually work paying for the people that do not. now there are those who actually need it to survive, i know that, however there are those who do not, but still use it. Also there are many who, because they can just get a free handout, get so much into a rut and do not try to get out of their situation. They do not try to find a better way. Yes, there are cases where welfare has served as a way to get people back on their feet, but those are not cases you see every day.
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#36 Post by Gandalf de Grijze » 21 Jun 2008 17:50

hmm, here in holland, all government aid is tied to a lot of rules, and in general the funding people get when not working is below the lowest salaries so to force them to actually work for their money.

those that do not follow the rules or don't meet the requirements will not get (or only partially get) the funds. all in all, it is a matter of teh strong shouldering the weak, and that is a good thing.. survival of teh fittest is just an arrogant selfish notion which shouldn't work in civilized societies
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#37 Post by ThePKH » 21 Jun 2008 19:13

Zeernebrooch wrote:Don't get me wrong i think in theory it can be a great idea, but for a country who's already in what a couple trillion in debt? I just do not see it as a good idea at the moment. Now once i am actually in need of the service perhaps i will see things differently.
That's true. But keep in mind that a good bunch of European countries adopted free health care not a long time after World War two. So money is not the main issue, it's the will. Though lack of money can indeed show as lack of will.

Gandalf de Grijze wrote:hmm, here in holland, all government aid is tied to a lot of rules, and in general the funding people get when not working is below the lowest salaries so to force them to actually work for their money.
Much like here. I don't recommend anyone to try poverty even in a wellfare state, but to some it could be an eye-opener. Just because you can pay the rent and buy food (and maybe a pair of socks once a month) doesn't make you live like a king. It's mere survival.
all in all, it is a matter of teh strong shouldering the weak, and that is a good thing..
Totally agree.
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#38 Post by Led Guardian » 23 Jun 2008 19:36

Zeernebrooch wrote:Now once i am actually in need of the service perhaps i will see things differently.
That sounds suspiciously like the beginnings of hypocrisy.
Zeernebrooch wrote:I think most of my anti-big government comes from the fact that i hate that it gets to a point that a insane amount of the money that you worked for is used to fund things that will not necessarily be used by you.
Ah yes, that's called selfishness, and it's one of the most recognizable symptoms of egocentrism. I fight with that myself sometimes. You should try to fix it.
Zeernebrooch wrote:For instance i see the welfare system as the people that actually work paying for the people that do not. now there are those who actually need it to survive, i know that, however there are those who do not, but still use it. Also there are many who, because they can just get a free handout, get so much into a rut and do not try to get out of their situation. They do not try to find a better way. Yes, there are cases where welfare has served as a way to get people back on their feet, but those are not cases you see every day.
Somehow, I suspect that the majority (or at least a large plurality) of people on welfare are people who actually need it. It's not like it gives you that much money. It allows you to live at about a minimum subsistence level. Just because there are some people who don't actually need it doesn't mean that we should take it away from everyone who does.
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#39 Post by Skyclad » 23 Jun 2008 19:40

Led Guardian wrote:
Zeernebrooch wrote:Now once i am actually in need of the service perhaps i will see things differently.
That sounds suspiciously like the beginnings of hypocrisy.
Zeernebrooch wrote:I think most of my anti-big government comes from the fact that i hate that it gets to a point that a insane amount of the money that you worked for is used to fund things that will not necessarily be used by you.
Ah yes, that's called selfishness, and it's one of the most recognizable symptoms of egocentrism. I fight with that myself sometimes. You should try to fix it.
Zeernebrooch wrote:For instance i see the welfare system as the people that actually work paying for the people that do not. now there are those who actually need it to survive, i know that, however there are those who do not, but still use it. Also there are many who, because they can just get a free handout, get so much into a rut and do not try to get out of their situation. They do not try to find a better way. Yes, there are cases where welfare has served as a way to get people back on their feet, but those are not cases you see every day.
Somehow, I suspect that the majority (or at least a large plurality) of people on welfare are people who actually need it. It's not like it gives you that much money. It allows you to live at about a minimum subsistence level. Just because there are some people who don't actually need it doesn't mean that we should take it away from everyone who does.
There are a lot of people on welfare that don't need it. Tons of them get welfare, then work for cash under the table.
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#40 Post by ThePKH » 23 Jun 2008 19:52

Skyclad wrote:There are a lot of people on welfare that don't need it. Tons of them get welfare, then work for cash under the table.
Tons doesn't mean all, neither does it mean most. If such thing is possible it's the system's fault, not the fault of those who actually need that money to survive.
Or should we just put everyone down to the gutter, regardless of wether they need it or not?
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#41 Post by Gandalf de Grijze » 23 Jun 2008 20:45

ThePKH wrote:
Skyclad wrote:There are a lot of people on welfare that don't need it. Tons of them get welfare, then work for cash under the table.
Tons doesn't mean all, neither does it mean most. If such thing is possible it's the system's fault, not the fault of those who actually need that money to survive.
Or should we just put everyone down to the gutter, regardless of wether they need it or not?
I agree, there are many ways to select those that need welfare. It is just a matter of tightening the rules so that the amount of people who abuse welfare gets pushed back. There are even plenty of ways to put sanctions against abuse of welfare.
Here in Holland there are also people who just abuse the rules to get welfare without having to work for the money. Gladly the amount is not so big, mainly because it is difficult to get the welfare funds..
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#42 Post by Skyclad » 23 Jun 2008 21:20

ThePKH wrote:
Skyclad wrote:There are a lot of people on welfare that don't need it. Tons of them get welfare, then work for cash under the table.
Tons doesn't mean all, neither does it mean most. If such thing is possible it's the system's fault, not the fault of those who actually need that money to survive.
Or should we just put everyone down to the gutter, regardless of wether they need it or not?
Maybe not half, but I bet 30% of the people on welfare don't need it. I'm not saying to abolish welfare, but it should be tougher to get than it already is. People abuse wrokman's comp. and disability the same way.
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#43 Post by Led Guardian » 24 Jun 2008 03:55

I know that there are people who do abuse it, but let me reiterate:
Led Guardian wrote:Just because there are some people who don't actually need it doesn't mean that we should take it away from everyone who does.
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#44 Post by West Virginia Mule » 24 Jun 2008 05:47

Skyclad wrote:I bet 30% of the people on welfare don't need it. I'm not saying to abolish welfare, but it should be tougher to get than it already is. People abuse wrokman's comp. and disability the same way.
QFE.

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#45 Post by Led Guardian » 24 Jun 2008 19:34

The Wrong Mule wrote:QFE.
WTF?
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#46 Post by Ramenudle » 27 Jun 2008 18:21

The Wrong Mule wrote:QFE.
Quoted for emphasis...

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#47 Post by NightReaper » 27 Jun 2008 18:32

As it is with politics everywhere around the world. The voter simply chooses the lesser evil. All politicians are the same when it comes down to it. They will never be as high and mighty as they make out, say things they will not achieve etc etc. Choose the best liar, that's what I say.

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#48 Post by Skyclad » 27 Jun 2008 18:52

NightReaper wrote:As it is with politics everywhere around the world. The voter simply chooses the lesser evil. All politicians are the same when it comes down to it. They will never be as high and mighty as they make out, say things they will not achieve etc etc. Choose the best liar, that's what I say.
We used to have politicians that did what they said. John Adams for one.
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#49 Post by Led Guardian » 27 Jun 2008 22:39

Or maybe they did the same things and have just been glorified over time.
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#50 Post by West Virginia Mule » 28 Jun 2008 00:43

Skyclad wrote:John Adams
Jeez, I wish someone would make a cable TV documentary about him.

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